Wednesday, January 04, 2006

Have A Baby So We Can Make More Money

Has anyone seen those "having a baby changes everything" ads sponsored by Johnson and Johnson? These are a series of commercials that show happy middle class white people with their babies having the time of their life. They start off by pointing out how selfish and shallow you are or were before having a baby and then they end the commercial by saying you can fix this unhealthy lifestyle by having a baby and buying a lot of Johnson and Johnson products. After the commercial they give you a link to baby.com. On baby.com you can find all the reasons you should be a parent, find baby names, get advice on weight gain during pregnancy, get advice on your relationship with your partner and of course get all kinds of offers on Johnson and Johnson products that you will surely need before and after having this little savior. Baby.com also has a link to babycenter.com which is also owned by Johnson and Johnson. On babycenter.com you can buy their books, clothes, strollers, and all kinds of other baby related gear that you will need to make your new family complete.

In other words, forgive me for not wanting to take Johnson and Johnson's advice on why I should be having a baby; I think they have a biased take on the subject. This attitude towards having a child is fairly common in our culture today. The message to single people, couples without children and people who are unable to conceive is essentially that you are not important, your life is not complete and you are not a true American, and thus will pay the price until you have children.

It's bad enough that childless people are already one of the most discriminated against groups in America. How many times have people with kids taken all their sick and vacation days in the first part of the year only to have their kids get sick in the winter and are then allowed to take extra time off? Why can't I get off extra time when I have to take my dog to the vet, or just because I want to be treated as an equal to people with kids? Who gets all the time off from work when they are pregnant or after they have a baby? Who gets all the per-child and child care tax credits? On the other hand, how many times have I been told at work that I am the one who should be going to out of town meetings the most because I have no kids? Who are the ones who have to stay late after work since they don't have to pick anyone up for soccer practice? Who are the ones who have to pay the taxes to support these people's children when they go to school or when they are unable to support their kids financially? Whose insurance premiums increase to allow everyone else to have babies? If you can't afford, or are unwilling to pay the price of having a child then don't have one; it's that simple. Why is one lifestyle rewarded but mine is not? Why don't I get tax credits for rescuing two shelter dogs? Is it because Johnson and Johnson is a bigger company and has more influence than the Nutro dog food company or my local pet store? The only people who should be getting tax breaks for having children are people who adopt.

I have nothing against people who have or want kids so why do they have so much against me? Don't make me pick up the bill or make me feel inferior for not making the same choices you have made. It is a lifestyle choice plain and simple. Forgive me for wanting to watch an entire movie without interruption, for enjoying a night on the town, for enjoying hot meals, for valuing a full night's rest, for not having to save for college and for being able to leave the country whenever I please. Some people choose to stay single, some people can't have kids and some people do have kids so does that make them so special? Why do they get all the breaks?

Why does the term "family values" only apply to people with kids? Does that mean couples who live together or the ones who can't have children have no values because they don't need a parental lock on their TV? Does this mean "family values" is all about free handouts as long as you play ball, and punishment if you don't? Just because you have kids and don't want them to hear the F word why do I have to pay the consequences? Maybe I do want to hear the F word; maybe I want to see naked lesbians making out on Skinemax and maybe I don't want to watch Look Who's Talking 2 and Disney movies over and over and over again. I have the freedom to choose that just as you have the freedom to not have cable or the internet in your child’s bedroom.

Don't force your economic burden and lifestyle on everyone else just because you decided to have kids, it doesn't make you better than the rest of us. Look, I am no Libertarian, I am not saying that my tax money that goes towards public schools doesn't end up benefiting the whole of society but just because you know someone with a penis and something fell out of your uterus doesn't mean that we should hand you a pile of cash or that it puts you on top of the world’s food chain. That's my rant for now; that commercial is dumb!

63 comments:

The Life Of Me in 2006 said...

What are you on about on my blog are you speaking icelandic i speak english !

Mike V. said...

I am going to tell you a story that happened just last month.

Several of us coworkers went out for dinner for the Holidays.
Anyway, since my wife and I have been married just over a year (and even before that) certain people have been bugging the heck out of us about having kids.
Well, that night while a couple of the girls were in the powder room, one of my coworker's wife (who I really do like, she's very sweet) cornered my wife about it and would not let up.
The bottom line of the conversation was summed up thus by the end:
"You're not really a family if you don't have kids."
"A child helps to make your relationship complete".
Now, I'm sorry, but no matter how much I like this person, I sort of consider that insulting.
My wife was sort of taken by surprise at this point and said that now is especially not a good time, because we're hoping on doing a long vacation this time next year, etc.
It sort of ended when this young lady said that my wife "didn't want to come back from vacation a year later and still not be pregnant but I'll probably be pregnant with another baby." ??!

What it usually boils down to it seems like to me is that people want you to be as miserable as they are or something.

Karenpuppy said...

Being a woman, I've seen the Pyramid Scam of "woman on woman violence" (sadly, not the naughty skinemax variety).

1st, your worthless if you're alone. 2nd, if you have a man, you're relationship is worthless unless he marries you. 3rd, if you're married, you're worthless unless you have kids. 4th, you're worthless if your family doesn't "keep up with the Joneses." To paraphrase Mike, misery loooooves company.

As for me, I'm just looking for a man who's had/is willing to have a vascetomy.

Toad734 said...

Ok, so I am not alone. I thought I was going out on a limb with this one.

Mike,

I am not saying that having a kid is all misery and I don't think anyone thinks that but I think you are on to something when everyone either wants to fit in, or they get nervous when someone else is doing thing a little differently.

I personally love kids, other people’s kids. That lifestyle just isn't for me; it's not the kid it's what comes with it. My dogs are plenty to keep us busy and plenty of responsibility. As soon as they make a kennel for kids I may consider it.

As far as the relationship complete part I think that couldn't be further from the truth. Married people need time to know and live with each other before they drag someone else into it. What's worse than realizing the person you married is not what you thought is realizing that after you have had 2 kids.

There is no rush, unless you are 45.

Mike V. said...

LOL!
I'm almost there, I'll be 40 this year.

We have 3 dogs, it's enough right now.

I love the people that say you are selfish if you don't pop out kids right away and want to vacation and do things.
They made the choice, yet when you DO go on vacation, they make little comments about not being able to do that stuff.
Tough shit!

Boiled Owl said...

By all means, unless you really love kids, and are ready to stop being one yourself, please, please, please, don't have them. (And even then, think twice.)

Dani said...

Quit whining Toad! Now you sound like the crybabies you are so jealous of.

Poor, poor Toady! He feels discriminated against because doesn’t get extra time off of work because he would rather sleep in, watch naked lesbians and live a selfish life void of any responsibility. Oh how sad for you Toady!

American people do not value having children anyway, so I don’t know what you have your panties in a bunch for – you fit right in!

Actually the message to single people and couples without children is have an abortion! Children are needy, expensive and a burden on your life – it is much, much easier to kill them. Plus with your genetics Toad, and according to your logic, your offspring would end up being a criminal so you would be doing society a favor by killing them before they enter the world. Planned Parenthood is happy to help anyone willing to get rid of their offspring – so just speak to them if your girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant!

BTW - I wonder if your dogs will be there to take care of you when you are on your death bed?

Son of Lilith said...

dani, I thought that was heavy, HEAVY sarcasm until I clicked on your profile.

Anyway, I believe that people with kids do deserve a bit more leeway for the welfare of the kids if nothing else. But the childless should not be treated as expendable assets because they have all this free time and money on their hands.

And kids do not define completion. We all define our own successes. I think it would be great to have kids--when I'm old and mature enough, and have enough money to provide for them and enough time to give them. Maybe I'll be 50 and adopting, who knows.

The point is that I don't want kids right now or in the foreseeable future. In fact, I would be willing to have a vasectomy to avoid any "accidents." I want to enjoy MY life, with MY goals, and one of MY goals is NOT HAVING CHILDREN.

This makes me no more selfish than someone who has children just so that THEY feel a sense of completion.

Toad734 said...

Dani is exactly what I am talking about. She is one of the people with empty lives that have nothing else going for them so they selfishly have children as a pet project in order to help with their low self esteem. That is another situation where one should not procreate.

But Dani, thanks for the tip; I will be sure to pay a visit to planned parenthood if pregnancy does get in the way of my dreams of living on the fly, living for myself, having fun and not having to worry about a babysitter.

Dani what makes you think I am jealous? I don't want kids and trust me $1500 less a year and a couple of days off of work is not worth it.

By the way I have as much, if not more responsibility than you have. Do you work and pay bills or do you stay home all day playing Sunday school teacher? So ya, picking the kids up from soccer practice is responsibility but so is keeping up with all the new abortion methods and day after pills.

Most parents don't value children but American society, which is all caught up in catchy phrases clearly does act as if it cares about children. Where do you think the tax credits and days off come from?

How would by children be criminals? And if you do know that your children will turn into the next Hitler or Dahmer, by all means you are right, get an abortion.

Oh and if I am such a cry baby and I have nothing to bitch about send me the money you guys save on taxes this year by having children. It's clearly the parents who are bitching whining and complaining about how expensive it is to raise a child, that they need day care tax credits (whether they actually pay for day care or not)and propose lifting sales tax on diapers and other baby goods. That’s like me going out and buying a Hummer then complaining about the payments and how much it cost to fill up the tank every other day and then making you pay for it.

If you don't have the money to raise a kid, don't have a kid.

By the way I may want to become a parent now just to spite you. It would be great when my kid who wouldn't believe that Adam and Eve rode Dinosaurs to church every Sunday got in a scientific debate with one of your kids. That would be cool.

Ok so I just thought of one reason to have a kid.

And no, my dogs won't be taking care of me when I am 90, hopefully I will be dead. I don't know where you think you live but in America children don't take care of their parents; they suck them dry for 25 years and then throw them into a nursing home. But I can assure you that my dogs will never steal from me, will never hit me, will never say they hate me, will never wish they could run away from me, will never lie to me, will never tell me I make them want to kill themselves, never keep me up all night crying, never hold a grudge against me, never stop loving me, never call me to bail them out of jail, never make me cry, never keep me from doing the things I want to do, and will do everything in their power at all times to make sure that I am safe and happy.

That's a lot more than I can say about most people, let alone kids and teenagers.

Mike V. said...

LOL@ Dani!

Good one.

I bet you did think she was heavy on the sarcasm, Brandon.
A sane person would think that. And a sane person would never write what she wrote.

So, Dani, one of the reasons to have kids is so they can take care of you when you get old? What kind of guilt trip is that to lay on your offspring? Why not be smart and plan well for your older years so they don't have to.
To do OTHERWISE seems quite selfish to me, not a person that chooses to not procreate.

Please tell me where the message is to people to have an abortion?
Abortion rates per capita have been falling for over 25 years.

Oh, and a life without kids is a life without responsibility?
Ever hear of a mortgage? Taxes? WORK?

God, you are one crazy broad.

Mike V. said...

One more thing.
You want fewer abortions in the US of A?
Then you better be shouting from the tallest rooftops that everyone that wants it has access to free birth control and free Plan B, particularly for those that may not be able to afford to buy it.

Thankfully, there are avenues through Planned Parenthood to get them, but not everyone has that available to them.

Dani said...

Toad:
You asked: Do you work and pay bills or do you stay home all day playing Sunday school teacher?

Yes, in addition to being a home-educator, I am also a full-time domestic engineer who manages my own household to ensure that there is order, proper cleanliness, warmth and happiness at all times (or at least by the end of the day). There are no days off for me. I get no sick days, and my work is never done. I am a caregiver who tends to all the physical, emotional and spiritual needs of all those in my household 24 hours a day. Furthermore I am a nutritionist who cooks three meals a day to ensure healthy, delicious and well-balanced meals for my family and those in my care. I run an enterprise dedicated to teaching obedience and building the character of its members and training them to be fully equipped for the battle ahead. Monday –Friday I also run a licensed, full-time childcare out of my home where I watch over other peoples children up to 10 hours a day.

I don’t know who you’re talking about, but I never whine and complaining about how expensive it is to raise a child. We don’t have SSN for our children so we don’t save on taxes by having kids. But maybe we’ll reconsider since we want to have at least 3-4 more which would make 7 children. Wow – we could be rich!

You should have kids at some point – but not until you’re married and not just to spite me. And for the record, my kids would rip your kids to shreds in any debate – but it would still be fun to watch.

Mike:
You said “one of the reasons to have kids is so they can take care of you when you get old.”

Sure, why not? That is what families are supposed to do – they take care of each other. Of course that is not our motive in having kids, but it is a good by-product of having a lot of children and raising them right. But not anymore for most people today. Just like Toad said: in America children don't take care of their parents; they suck them dry for 25 years and then throw them into a nursing home. Sad but true!

These are the same parents who threw their kids in a daycare and other institutionalized learning centers for other people to teach, train and raise, then the parents wonder why their kids won’t take care of them when they need it. Hmmm? But they got a tax break, right? Whoopee!

What is selfish are parents who send their children to a bureaucratic daycare each day so they don’t have to be parents. These same parents are out to lunch throughout their children’s entire lives then they can’t seem to understand why their kids steal from them, hit them, say they hate them, wish they could run away, lie, tell them they want to kill themselves, keep them up all night crying, hold a grudge against them, stop loving them, call them to bail them out of jail, and on and on.

What is also selfish are children who don’t care for their parents when they need them because it is a burden on their lives. Our parents gave us life – the least we can do as their children is help care for them in their old age.

Toad734 said...

I too have to manage a household and keep it clean and keep food on everyone’s plate and keep my dogs fed, train my dogs, go to work, pay bills, play on a dart team, work out from time to time and write music. And you say I don't have responsibilities. I do everything you do except for watching 10 kids plus work and pay bills.

Yes having a kid would be extra responsibility that I don't want. You know what else would be extra responsibility that I don't want? Owning a plane and a horse, starting a business, volunteering at the library, starting a cult, all of these things would be extra responsibility but I don't think you could call me lazy for not doing them.

Talk about how evil the school system is all you want but not everyone can afford to stay home with the kids, not everyone has a husband to earn the cash for them, some families have to have 2 incomes to survive. Would it be nice to be able to stay home with your kids and teach them yourself, assuming you had a teaching degree, maybe it would. Not everyone has that luxury and not everyone is qualified to do it.

And yes, having kids so they can take care of you when you are old is way more selfish than not having kids. As I said am I selfish for not being a horse breeder, and not going to the Peace Corps and handing out soup at the homeless shelter, and trying to solve deforestation in third world countries?

Mike V. said...

Dani, you just made Toad's point for him.

There is a use for you yet.

Son of Lilith said...

Our parents gave us life – the least we can do as their children is help care for them in their old age.

I didn't ask to be born. I did not request conception, nor did I petition for my mother to carry me to term and birth me.

My life is the result of my parents' choice to have sex, plain and simple.

I owe nobody anything for giving me life. Hell, if anything children should be angry at their parents for producing them and bringing them into this world of struggle and pain.

What I am thankful for, and owe my parents their love and respect for, is raising me in a comfortable home with all of my needs met. I was never abused, neglected, or belittled.

That is what makes a good parent, not merely having children.

And dani, while I respect your responsibilities, labeling yourself a "domestic engineer" is a bit of a stretch. You did not have to apply for your job, did not face any competition, and run no real risk of being fired. An "official" title is a bit much; anyway, if you're so happy about being a wife and mother, why not skip the bullshit and just call yourself a "wife and mother?"

Dani said...

Oh Toad – Stop being so sensitive! I never said you were lazy, I’m sure you are a hard worker. And I never said you should have children if you are not ready for the responsibility of parenthood. Once you find a good wife, then you can start a family and share the responsibilities of raising kids together.

Mike – What was the point again?

Brandon – You are the classic example of a self-centered individual! “I want to enjoy MY life, with MY goals. Me, Me, Me! I didn't ask to be born. I did not request conception, nor did I petition for my mother to carry me to term and birth me…I owe nobody anything for giving me life.” Oh – save it for someone who cares! Maybe your mom should have had an abortion?

And for the record - I did call myself a “wife and mother” it’s the first sentence in my profile remember? Domestic engineer just sounds cool. Plus, I just like getting under Toad’s skin and pissing all you guys off! Seems to be working!

Son of Lilith said...

What I am thankful for, and owe my parents their love and respect for, is raising me in a comfortable home with all of my needs met. I was never abused, neglected, or belittled.


Oh yes, self-centered I am. Self-centered, that is me. I care about no one but myself.

Be careful you don't fall and hurt yourself getting off that soapbox dani.

Two Minutes J said...

Dani- So you're a 'domestic engineer' because you stay at home all day and hold down the fort? And a 'nutritionist' for cooking a couple of meals? Hah. So does that mean that I'm a 'Professional Online Dater' because I've picked up and banged chicks off of the internet? Or no wait, I got it, I'm "Research and Development on the causes and effects of Heroin Addiction", since I used to be a heroin addict. Or ever better, how about "Professional Low-Life", since these choices I've made aren't exactly socially acceptable behaviors?

Son of Lilith said...

And I'm a Private Domestic Wildlife Care Specialist because I dog sit for a friend.

Toad734 said...

I am a Traveling Ale Consumption and Testing Research Specialist Engineer. The pay is terrible but the benefits are great.

Dani:

How about this: When I get married I'll share the responsibilities of being married and providing for ourselves and I still won't have kids.

NewsBlog 5000 said...

I think Dani made an important point.

Who wouldn't want to watch naked lesbians and live a selfish life void of any responsibility?

Actually, I just don't want to have kids because it has dropped the IQ of everyone I know by about 20 points. And for some of the slower ones, that even meant voting Republican. If it's a choice between procreation and not losing my mind, I'll choose to keep my brain.

Grant said...

I love children. They taste like chicken. J&J's view on things sounds a lot like my redneck family. Success in life is judged by how quickly you marry and how many children you pump out. They don't value things like education, career, self-fullfillment, and crap like that.

I met a woman at a party once who asked me how many children I wanted to have (she skipped asking me if I wanted any at all). I told her I didn't want any and she replied "You're selfish." I explained my belief that people who have children (on purpose) are pursuing their life's goals just as I am, so what makes them so benevolent? It's not as if they actually say "I want to live my life for somebody else - I will get absolutely nothing from this relationship." After a lengthy explanation, she simply repeated "You're selfish" and walked away. Darn - she could have been the one. :p

Anonymous said...

Oh woe are you! You love not having kids so you can watch a movie without having peanut butter smeared on your sweater but you can't stand having a responsive society so that the children that are here can be properly cared for. You love those big fat children's paint brushes for making your broadly brushed points but don't want to clean up the mess after a kid uses one. And then you expect everyone else's kids to care for you in your elderly years? Or are you just going to step into a suicide chamber and end it all when you realize you need the following generation's assistance even though you slammed them and their parents with a bunch of silly insults trying to cover up that empty feeling inside you. Because if it really weren't an issue, you wouldn't be finding all these reductionist reasons to bitch about....

Mike V. said...

grant, people that say you're selfish for not wanting to have kids at all fall into two camps:
One, people that want you to be as miserable as they are, because they were too stupid to understand the responsibilities and such that went along with kaving kids.
Two, girls that have a "ticking clock", watch too much stupid TV and read too many idiot magazines that tell them they are not complete without "husband and kids".
Don't you know it's not American unless you breed like a rabbit, move to the suburbs and drive an SUV? Damn, dude.. :)

BRUISER said...

In the immortal words of one Micheal Tyson : " I will eats your children "


Dani is like the idiot running our country...just no common sense and don't give me that Domestic Engineer crap...your home schooled kids might in fact be the ones who cause your own untimely demise as the Ohio Homeschool Massacre did just a few months back.

Well I do think that these rightwing nutbags and leftwing nutbags who have kids and want those with none to feel for them and give them leeway is complete bullshit. Fuck'em you chose kids have the Hard way you asked for and quit leaving me with all your unfinished work late on a Friday bithes!!!! Take to task your own responsibility.

Proud2Breed said...

Y'all seem to have some unspoken, perhaps unrealized, fear that maybe, just maybe you are missing out.

I totally admist I had kids for selfish reasons. I love to love them and love when they love me back. Give me the grubby banana hands of my toddler, the silly pronouncments of my 9 year old son, and the eye rolls of my 11 year old daughter any day over the emptiness that I suspsect that you secretly suspect your busy existence is trying to fill.

Mike V. said...

Is there any way that we could have the above post translated into English?

Your last sentence butchers our language in ways that I cannot even begin to understand..

As for your first "statement", assuming we have working penises and vaginas in the collective households here, fear of missing out on something could be fixed (as it were) fairly easily.

I don't know how to respond to the second part of your post because I don't know what it says.

Toad734 said...

Anonymous:

Great Society. Ever hear of Social Security, 401ks and nursing homes?

Again if you are having kids so someone will wipe your ass when you are old then you sir are selfish.

And again, where do you think you live? This is not old world Europe, this is not China, what do you think your kids are going to do with you when you start shitting yourself? They are going to throw you in an old folks home and go boating. So I hope you have more reasons such as illiterate for having kids.

Two Minutes J said...

First off, anyone who posts a comment under the name of "anonymous", should have their post immediately disqualified for the lack of responsibility in being identified.

Second, most people I know who have kids had them by accident. They're more of a burden than anything. Also, children are taught to hate. Racism is taught, Stupidity is taught, etc. Alot of people having kids shouldn't be having kids.

I overheard a conversation at work. It was ridiculous, this chick had two separate pictures of her kids. She said this, "Yeeah, I'm like wantin' to frame this one an' send it to my baby daddy on houz arrest. and then frame 'dis one and send it to my other babbys daddy in prison." My point exactly, some people shouldn't fucking have kids.

On the other hand, if you have a stable family and are not completely brainwashing your "test subjects" with right-wing nazi-republican ideology, then you're ok in my book. Have your kids.

I dig kids. I just don't want any right now. Maybe someday, but only if I'm stable and have the resources to provide the child with everything it needs. Unless, a mistake happens. In which case, that reminds me, I should probably learn how to wear a rubber. But hey, thats what abortion is for!

"ABORTION: Pulling out takes practice"

Anonymous said...

I'm the previous anymous poster. I'm new to blogosphere, don't have a blogger id, and I've seen plenty of anymous posts. How is not knowing who I am negating of my thoughts? Why is it my "responisibility" to put up some moniker that wouldn't really identify me anyway? Because later I could be held accountable from some essentially anymous person indirectly communicating to me through a bunch of wires that prevent us from really knowing each other anyway? Get over it, already.

Second, I didn't say I had my kids with my own elderly care as the main motivating factor. Indeed, I don't think that was even on my mind in the moment. My point is that the original post seemed so full of hateful resentment of the societal necesseties to raise the next generation, but who ... even as employees in a nursing home ... is going to care for our generation as we age and need help? If you resent the time parents need to raise decent people, then die by the sword you're wielding now and off yourself before today's kids become the middle agers of your future old age.

Third, actually this current 50-60 year old generation is taking more personal care of their now elderly parents than the preceding one. It's a huge trend. Sheesh. http://www.bizjournals.com/denver/stories/2003/03/17/focus3.html <-- just after a quick google search but I can tell you it's been highlighted in many papers and magazines.

That overheard conversation ... great ... extrapolate from one incident to indict a whole much larger group? Otherwise, what's you're point? There are idiots and jerks in every group. So what was your point in bringing up that example? I didn't say >anyone< who doesn't want kids shouldn't benefit in the future from the next generation. My point was people who are unwilling to accomodate a society's needs to raise healthy kids should abdicate future benefits derived from the generation they so vocally resent.

Having kids is very very rewarding. Undue pressure to people who don't want kids is stupid and mean, yes. But bitching about people needing to take time off to care for sick kids, or the fact that someone else has a greater desire and need to go home on Friday evening doesn't change the fact that those are the practical aspects of living with people in general. If the poster can't allow for the raising of kids, then I suggest he give up all future needs from that generation. Don't hire them, don't make money off them, don't expect them to care for you. If you can't participate in a society that can nurture them, or do so grudgingly and bitchingly, then why expect benefit from their very presence later on down the road?

Anyway, ageism is ultimately sexism but that would open up a whole other set of arugments.

NewsBlog 5000 said...

anonymous - If you click on "other" when you enter your comment, you can choose a non-blogger handle (like proud2breed above), but we can have an easy way to tell you from other anonymous people. And please stop using the word 'blogsphere'.

When I tick over my century counter, I hope to be taking full advantage of younger generations. And, by that, I mean I want to have sex with your great-granddaughters.

So, to all you people talking about the "rewards" of having children, having sex with your own great-granddaughters is just sick, you sickos. Except of course, karenpuppy, who is very cute and should breed. If I gave you my number, would your great-granddaughter call me a month before her age of consent?

Dani said...

Toady, Mike, Brandon, Grant & rest of the Gang:

All I have to say is ~ Thank the Good Lord you are not going to have children!

You all have proven to be completely self-absorbed and incapable of caring for another human being and not have children is in the best interest of everyone. The last thing America needs is another jackass generation of demoralized, rebellious and perverse little punks wreaking havoc on society and following in the footsteps of their loser fathers. We do not need anymore ignorant fools running around the U.S., so please, please, whatever you do – DO NOT REPRODUCE!

Once you all die (alone with your dogs), you will have no legacy behind you, your job and your girlfriend will replace you, and you will be forgotten!

Meanwhile, as for my family and thousands of other Christian families, we will be fruitful and multiply the earth and out number all you pagans!

So keep your worthless genes in your pants fellas - We don’t want your offspring growing up with our precious children!

Two Minutes J said...

Pagans!? What? did I miss something? Anyways, so thats why you have kids Dani? To keep your name going long after you die? What kind of sick twisted shit is that? As if your family is that important. I mean come on, you're not the Rockefellers.

And to you "Anonymous". You may want to go back to grade school with your kid for a few days and take Spelling lessons, just a hint.
Also, yea, you got me. I'm guilty. I took the one and only conversation I've ever heard and put a broad generalization on it. Dammit. I always do that!

erinberry said...

"And for the record, my kids would rip your kids to shreds in any debate – but it would still be fun to watch."

This Dani moron - What is she, in kindergarten?

Toad734 said...

Anonymous: As I said, it’s called a nursing home and money. If I have enough money I could hire my own professional ball washer when I am 90 if that is where I decide to spend my money.

Go to any nursing home today and tell me how many children are caring for their elderly parents.

And you speak of all these benefits of people having kids as if I should be puckering my lips on their ass for doing me the favor of reproducing. I just drove through the projects the other day and I didn't see how all the kids bashing windows out of burned out cars could possibly benefit me. In fact, I think they cost me money and divert resources from the things that this society and country needs. And I am sure the children the chick Two Minutes was referring to would fit in that same category.

I realize that in order for the economy to grow, the population, or at least consumer base, must grow. However, if you have read my previous posts you would realize that in 100 years the only jobs that will be available will be at Wal-Mart for wages lower than the poverty line. That being said, a larger population would make things worse for the people competing for these low wage jobs and will push wages down even further.

Now, in the scenario that Wal-Mart goes out of business and people in third world countries unionize and have to follow emission standards of the west and our economy produces more livable wage jobs we can fix any decline in birth rates with immigration. Mexico, Central America, Russia, Nigeria, India etc will all be more than happy to accommodate those needs. Japan is currently going through a population decrease and they will have to resort to immigration in order to fill low wage jobs and to keep the economy moving forward. So in other words I can always hire a Russian nurse to care for me if I don't have children.

Dani:

Umm so are you saying your children are carrying your last name? An old fashioned Bible thumper like you sounds like the type who would take her husbands name, not keep her maiden name. And how much do I know about my great grandfather? Without doing one of those family tree things who knows about anyone other than their grandparents? And how do you say I don't care for others because I don't have kids? I've helped plenty of humans and animals in need during my tenure on this planet.

FOR THE LAST TIME IT DOESN'T TAKE A KID FOR SOMEONE TO BE SELFLESS, TO HAVE MORALS, TO BE COMPLETE, TO BE HAPPY, TO BE COMPASSIONATE, OR TO BE RESPONSIBLE!

I probably know more parents who are just the opposite of what I have just mentioned.

Dani said...

Toad - My last name is my husband's last name, same with my kids. Not that it matters! We will have lots of children, and our children will have lots of children, and before you know it, by the time you and all your buddies are dead, there will be Christians everywhere!

I agree with what you said - DON'T HAVE KIDS!

Mike V. said...

Tell me why it's not enough for my wife and I to just love each other and our extended families for now, if not forever?

Oh, and I think you should bring back the Tammy Faye photo you used to use, that was more fun to look at...

Mike V. said...

By the way, selfish is taking the last piece of cake before everyone has had a piece, not choosing not to breed.
Self absorbed is a person that doesn't care about the outside world around them.
Choosing to not procreate has nothing to do with either of these things.

Valkyrie said...

I've got an idea. Why don't we as a whole take care of all the children in the world before we adding more people?

Dani: Why don't you adopt?

There are so many children in need of homes and good families that (to me) it is seems selfish to have a 'natural' child.

Blood doesn't make a family, but love does.

But certain people make me want to grab the nearest sociopath and have my own children.

Son of Lilith said...

I always donate a portion of my income to charity and help my family with finances.

I go above and beyond my job description to help people that come into my workplace needing my assistance.

I have spent more time and money helping people not even related to me than most of my so-called Christian friends.

I have played the part of big brother to numerous people younger than me.

But since I have goals (charity being one of them) that I want to accomplish and realize that not having kids at age 23 will help me realize those goals makes me selfish?

Illogical at best, stupid at worst.

And dani, belive it or not, I am a Christian. I'm just not a Jesus Freak that distorts what the Bible says and realizes that the Bible is open to interpretation.

Dr. Van Skleeve said...

I saw an amusing bumper sticker recently:

"Can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em."

Same car also had another that read:

"Driving drunk? Take off your seatbelt."

Just had to share.

Anonymous said...

Pls. don't think Dani represents my viewpoint! I'm pagan and have kids and respect anyone's desire not to have kids. Just don't bitch about the legitimate needs of parents. ("It's not faaaaaaaiiiiiir" -- you sound like my tweener!) And don't think we're all getting rich off our paltry tax cuts, as if that's really an offset to what it takes to raise a kid.

But as usual, I see you're arguing what you >think< my point is rather than actually trying to understand what I wrote. Should I dumb it down for you?

NewsBlog 5000 said...

"Should I dumb it down for you?"

Maybe, but first I must know one thing. Isn't the "tweener" the patch of flesh between the genital and the anus? Does it make any other noises? If so, then yes, I am a little confused.

Son of Lilith said...

DISCLAIMER (FOR DANI): THE FOLLOWING IS HUMOR !

Toad mentioned having a Russian nurse to take care of him in his elderly years.

Having a fair-skinned, dark-haired, blue-eyed young lady with a Russian accent to take care of me in lieu of my own offspring?

It's official; I'm scheduling my visectomy tomorrow.

Dr. Van Skleeve said...

Have any of you seen "Logan's Run?"

Perhaps that's the system we need. It does have some great perks; except the clothing style is a little "far out" for my taste.

Of course, I'd end up being a "Runner" in the end, because I'm afraid of zero-g disintigration. Okay, maybe it is a bad idea after all...

Toad734 said...

I don’t know how into floating up to the ceiling and exploding I am.

SO I am out on the whole Logan’s Run Thing. I have also just dated myself.

Anonymous:

We don’t know who "you" are. So we don't think anything about you. You can dumb down what ever you wish but I wouldn't know if it needed dumping down in the first place. As far as the "not fair" comment goes I have this to say: Sure I know you are not getting rich off these perks and incentives the government gives to inform their version of correct lifestyle choices but that still doesn't mean I should have to pay for your kids diapers. As I have said before, obviously it is the parents who are bitching and crying about the expenses of having children or else they wouldn't be getting these tax breaks. After all, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.

That is my point exactly, we should be the ones crying and bitching but we are not, it is the parents and breeders who are complaining in order to get more tax breaks and to eliminate the sales tax on diapers and what not.

Black Mamba said...

I personally never want to have any kids because all they do is scream and cry and cost money. I'd like to see a Johnson and Johnson commercial about that crazy lady who a couple of years ago was so depressed that she drowned her five sons in the bath tub and tried to blame it on Jesus. Now that was one happy healthy Christian family! Hell, it even involves a tub. PERFECT for Johnson and Johnson. What you say is very true and very humorous.

Warriors!!!! WARRIORS!!!! Come out and playay!!!!! said...

"by the time you and all your buddies are dead, there will be Christians everywhere!"---
Says Dani---
yes Dani ...Christians, Muslims, Hindus, Pagans, Taoists, Maoists, Marxist,...and every other ist ist on the lists...but something makes me think you'll have passed on as well which makes me delighted. You have such good Krishna...I mean christian ethics about you....





" I live in a world of many worlds."- Edward Coogan







"You all have proven to be completely self-absorbed and incapable of caring for another human being and not have children is in the best interest of everyone. The last thing America needs is another jackass generation of demoralized, rebellious and perverse little punks wreaking havoc on society and following in the footsteps of their loser fathers."

So you are saying our collective fathers served no worth? You emo right wing evangelicals are yet again smearing soldiers who fought for your freedom. This epitomizes the need generation of the new millenia ...you need kids...you need the escalade...yet collectively you decide to pay the teachers, who feed your children knowledge & a sound responsible view of the world, anything close to what they should be making.
And collectively put that dumb son of Bush in office after selling your children's future to the National Debt Collectors known as China. Thank you for the second job in the service industry as you send more industry overseas to the lowest bidder. Way to think about your children. You make great parents. If that is your idea of parenting.

ps- America's appetite for perversity makes your "family" organizations billions yearly.

Son of Lilith said...

Here here!

KEvron said...

hey, toad,

i totally busted poison pero on that kennedy quote. it's a fabrication; no such letter exists. i asked him for a source for the quote, and he came clean, but played the whole thing off as an oversight on his part.

http://therightisright.blogspot.com/2006/01/persian-nuclear-crisis-part-i.html#comments

the dude lies to his own readers. i don't think i'm gonna let him live that one down....

KEvron

Mamacita said...

Let me just start by saying that I am a parent, a very happy one with a very incredible son. I did not get pregnant on purpose and I don’t know why I chose not to have an abortion, but obviously I didn’t have one. I have always been pro choice and continue to be pro choice, but I also value the idea of a functional family…what I consider functional. My little nuclear functional family has always consisted of my son and I. I am so sick and grossed out by people telling me the ways in which they think my household is dysfunctional and all of the ways that my perfectly wonderful little boy will be forever harmed when he grows up because there is no man in the house….Ummm. They obviously did not know his father. I am so thankful that I had the gall to make a decision to live an alternate lifestyle as a single parent without welfare while maintaining my intellect and allowing my son to experience a calm, intellectual, stress free home. My fun did not stop after having a child…I still get to be one. I get to snowboard, go to the library, eat good food, and do all of the other things I want to. When I want to throw back some Guinness I can – thanks to my parents. I don’t feel inhibited, I definitely don’t get any extra time off at work, and yes, I am thankful for the tax break…I put the savings away in my son’s college fund so he will have the chance to become a productive, educated adult.

Not having children is almost always a better thought out decision than choosing to have them. Decisions that are made with care, such as this, are generally good ones. Conversely, well thought out plans to have children are usually made by caring, responsible individuals that will do their best to raise responsible children. To each his own. I support and admire those who choose not to have kids, it’s very socially responsible. I also think it’s great for those who choose to have kids, as long as they teach them well and don’t ask me to babysit or bring them screaming into a movie theater.

So, if you don’t want children – great! You can play with my son. (under my supervision, of course) He’s real cool and he’s learning to play the guitar and very well may be the next Tony Hawk. And yes, being a parent is the best thing that’s ever happened to me, but it’s certainly not for everyone…

mamacita said...

By the way...some of you may enjoy the following site, since you hate kids and all - haha:

http://www.wimp.com/subtitles/

Boiled Owl said...

Mamacita, I'm crazed for all 7 of my kids, and all 5 of their kids.

They made me that way.

And they're they're still at it, even though some of them are well into their 30s. I don't look to the future to have them take care of me by the way, they've done it all along.

It became clear to me from the very first birth that William Wordsworth was right when he wrote, "The child is the father of the man."

Grant said...

Dani: "My last name is my husband's last name..." Is that before or after you got married? :p

I kid because I care.

Toad734 said...

For a lot of people, probably mamcia as well, it takes having a child to straighten their lives out. Sometimes it takes that to steer a person down a focused path. I don't feel I am on the wrong path nor do I feel like I need help with my life; maybe that is the exact reason I don't want a kid, or maybe I just realized that a dog was enough responsibility and the most I would want to be tied down.

Mike V. said...

I appreciate mamacita's well reasoned comment.

Heck, I'm having a love affair with the whole human race.. :)

Son of Lilith said...

Ladies and gentlemen, the voice of reason: mamacita.

Da Katz & Reni said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Da Katz & Reni said...

Several months after I got married--for the first time at age 36--the very first insult I recieved on top of the one where I was supposed to twiddle my thumbs at home til I got pregnant (which still hasn't happened--although I do want a daughter soon)--the "minister" of my congregation felt I shouldn't be there, because my husband was working out of state at the time as a contract engineer.

I was supposed to follow him around like a puppy dog in spite of having disabled grandparents in a nursing home and four cats to look after and disabled family and two houses to move stuff from and all that... and a job and what else can I think of...

Oh yeah, I thought I had familial support from my congregation!!

Maybe the minister was jealous that he wasn't there to marry us or something... since we had our nice interfaith Jewish marriage without him... I dunno...

I seem to make him too nervous because I have too much chutzpah.

But life's too short to run off a cliff gooinng wheeee.....

Dani said...

Grant - My last name changed to my husband's last name the day we got married.

Toad, you are absolutely correct with your last statement. I had my first child at fifteen years old and it really forced me to straighten out my life. Sometimes it does take that to steer a person down a focused path. If it weren't for my daughter, Lord only knows where I would be today!

In my honest opinion: There is nothing to feel bad about if you don't want to have kids. Being childless is fine. But, I think you will truly be missing out on something marvelous.

erinberry said...

"We will have lots of children, and our children will have lots of children, and before you know it, by the time you and all your buddies are dead, there will be Christians everywhere!"

Hmm, you don't sound very Christian to me. But "cultish" fits you pretty well.

Anonymous said...

yea nothing wrong with choosing to be single, me thinks with toad that it may have more with the women choosing him to be single. What a waste of air you are Toad.

Toad734 said...

Who said I was single?